Test Settings And Benchmarks
We're bringing our old ASRock Dual939-SATA2 out of retirement for these tests. This motherboard is ideal for AGP comparisons because it sports both a full-speed PCIe x16 slot as well as a full-speed AGP 8x slot. This will allow us to compare the AGP Radeon HD 4650 against its PCIe counterpart to see if the aging bus is causing any performance loss.
In addition to the PCIe Radeon HD 4650, we'll test the long-standing AGP flagship, ATI's Radeon HD 3850. Also, for those of you thinking about upgrading an older card, we're throwing in a Radeon X700 Pro for reference. The Radeon X700 Pro's performance is roughly comparable to that of the Radeon 9800 Pro, Radeon X1300 Pro, and GeForce 6600 GT, so users of all these cards will have a good idea what they have to gain with an upgrade.
Our CPU of choice this time around will be AMD's Athlon 64 X2 3800+, one of the first dual-core CPUs available. We already know that most modern games benefit from at least a dual-core CPU, so we thought the Athlon 64 X2 3800+ would be a good baseline.
We were also planning to test an Athlon X2 5600+ in order to gauge which games were CPU- and GPU-limited. Unfortunately, our Athlon 64 X2 5600+ CPU didn't agree with the ASRock Dual939-SATA2 CPU expansion card, so we'll have to explore what a faster processor can do in the aforementioned follow-up.
As for the operating system, we've chosen good-old Windows XP 32-bit, which we think will be the typical operating system for an older box sporting AGP connectivity. In Part 2, we may explore what Vista can do. Let us know your thoughts on which you'd prefer to see tested in the comments section.
Note the Frankenstien-esque collection of RAM -- we considered cleaning this up, but it's probably a good representation of a lot of older rigs that have been upgraded over time. While the system sports a full 2 gigabytes of the stuff, it all has to run at the speed of the lowest common denominator, and that's DDR 333. Even so, this isn't likely to cause a large performance hit compared to running 400 MHz memory.
The only setup issue of note was the driver situation. The most recent Catalyst drivers don't seem to work with the new Gigabyte GV-R465D2-1GI AGP, so we used the ones that came bundled with the card. They worked fine with no issues, but buyers should know it might be a while (if at all) before the official Catalyst package supports this new graphics card. Other than that, we should mention that the antiquated Radeon X700 card isn't supported anymore, so we had to use older Catalyst 9.3 drivers.
| Test System Configuration | |
|---|---|
| CPU | Athlon 64 X2 3800+ |
| Motherboards | ASRock 9393dual-SATA2 |
| RAM | Patriot EP PC3500 (CL2.0-3-2-5) (1 x 1 GB) Kingston KVR PC3500 (CL3.0-3-3-8) (2 x 512 MB) Samsung PC2700 (CL2.5-3-3-7) (1 x 512 MB) |
| Graphics | Radeon HD 4650 AGP - 600 MHz GPU, 400 MHz Memory, 1 GB DDR2 |
| Hard Drive | Western Digital WD1200JB |
| Sound | Integrated Audio |
| Network | Integrated 100 Mb Networking |
| Power | Nextherm PSU460 |
Software | |
| OS | Microsoft Windows XP Professional 32-bit SP2 |
| Graphics | Radeon HD 4850 PCIe, Radeon HD 3850 AGP: Catalyst 9.6 |
| Benchmark Configuration | |
|---|---|
3D Games | |
| Left 4 Dead | Version 1014, Custom THG Benchmark |
| Crysis | Patch 1.2.1, DirectX 9, 32-bit executable, benchmark tool |
| Tom Clancy's H.A.W.X. | In-game benchmark |
| World in Conflict | Patch 1009, DirectX 10, timedemo |
| Fallout 3 | Custom THG Benchmark |
| Far Cry 2 | DirectX 9, 32-bit executable, benchmark tool |
Glad I seen this article, I've been looking for a card for my old dell 8300 for a couple of weeks now and think I've definately decided on the HD 3850.
Is there a way to work out what spec of processor would overcome the bottlenecking problems of a specific graphics card?
p.s. Don't have money for a new rig, so looking to spend as little as possible, so no comments on upgrading to pcie please.
if this article proves anything, its that older pc's can still cut it when it comes to gaming.. i don't play crysis or far cry 2. but my 5 year old single core amd 3000+ (754), and ati x1950pro graphic card can still handle the games of late.. it plays bioshock and Oblivion very well... but then if tech review sites and other media had my attitude then the pc industry would come to a standstill...
well done, good article, just placed a 3850 agp into a AMD 3000+ setup for my brother (Cheapest way to get a gaming system together as this was the only thing to purchase) and i must say it handles most games with zest, only newer games like Supreme commander and Far Cry do not run well on the machine ( CPU bottleneck) but i have a huge amount of brilliant 2004-2008 games that run perfectly on this system my brother is stoked, and LOTRO runs flat out max settings so perfect for his needs, and a bunch of five year old components saved fron trashing.
Really looking forward to the 2nd part of this Don!!
I currently run a 'AsRock 775i65G' with an 'Intel Core2Duo E6420' (2.13GHz 65nm) overclocked to 2.4GHz and the Front Side Bus is at 1200Mhz, along with 2GB of 'Kingston DDR Ram' (Dual Channel). The only thing I am currently looking for is to replace the AGP HD2600Pro as I can feel no bottleneck from the CPU, only the graphics card (had a AGP 1950Pro before it broke, tis was sweet).
Maybe your will to pick one up off ebay for cheap and look around the office for an old Intel 63XX or 64XX Core2Duo model to add to the tests, as it does allow for a more modern system with hopes of more CPU head room!!
So please don't forget us Intel fokes out there too!!....
Forgot Positivity!!
Maybe overclock the 3800+ x2, depending on the board's capability and chipset?
It's nice to see that AMD hasn't forgotten the AGP crowd, either, although I would have liked to see some GDDR5 memory thrown into the mix
Maybe even a Part III..which of the older chipsets and CPU combinations are best suited to overclocking? Naturally, one has to be mindful of the 'AGP and PCI lock' feature on these older boards, as the increase in speed can damage components if no such lock of available.
I wouldn't mind seeing the A64 x2, Pentium Dual-core and Core 2 put in the ring..what would give the killer blow: a slower, overlocked CPU with a more expensive card or a more modern architecture with a cheaper card? Or would it be better to simply sell the lot, and get something more modern? I did consider getting a 3800+ x 2 simply for the purpose of overclocking this S939 board (PCI-E), but these chips are like gold dust over here in the UK, and some of the prices charged on a certain auction site are ridiculous.
I did consider getting a 3800+ x 2 simply for the purpose of overclocking this S939 board (PCI-E), but these chips are like gold dust over here in the UK, and some of the prices charged on a certain auction site are ridiculous.
I had to be the "agent provoker" on this topic!! But certainly I have some experience of playing around with "older boards" (I am still using a dual-processor dual-core Opteron system - socket 940 - myself). In my experience "server" parts can get cheaper with age, "desktop" parts once no longer manufactured in quantity start to sky-rocket in price. Certainly that is my experience in the UK...
Try to get a decent skt 939 CPU such as an Opteron 185 or similar for a decent price on the Bay... DDR Ram costs a fortune. Older motherboards may have lots of bells and whistles for OC but generally use lower quality components (e.g. electrolytic capacitors, etc.)
AGP graphics cards also carry a premium over there PCIe equivalents. This holds true especially when selling second hand - nobody wants to upgrade a more modern PCIe MB to an out-of-date graphics card (given the current the Nvidia vs ATI price war). A good AGP GPU (e.g. 3850) will sell for a reasonable amount second hand.
Just my $.02...
Bob
I got the HD 4650 ;]] Clock it to the max get a better power supply and run the newest games on a 6 years old machine ! I'm playing GTA IV With no problem on HIGH !!!!!! 4650 RULEZZZZ !!!!!!