Sticky

Intel Coffee Lake (8th Generation) MegaThread! FAQ and Resources

Welcome to the Official Intel Coffee Lake 8000 series MegaThread!

This thread will serve as the primary discussion thread for all things regarding Coffee Lake. We’ll be updating as we gain more information.

***********************************************************************

The Coffee Lake Architecture:

Coffee Lake marks the third evolution in Intel’s series of skylake based CPUs. The first was Skylake, Intel’s first x86 architecture based on the 14nm process, Skylake improved several characteristics of previous architectures, including heat generation, power consumption and more IPC, allowing Skylake to be the most efficient and most powerful CPUs on the market during that time.

The next evolution was Kaby Lake; launched in 2016, Kaby Lake was based on a further optimization of the Skylake architecture, namely the 14nm+ process, this enabled Kaby Lake to push clock speeds well beyond the 4.5-4.7GHz barrier that most CPUs couldn’t surpass without noticeable CPU degradation.

Now, we have the latest improvement of the Skylake architecture; Coffee Lake. According to rumors, Coffee Lake is on an optimization known as the 14nm++ process, presumably this is simply another optimization like Kaby Lake to improve CPU clock speeds. Backing up this rumor are several other rumors stating that Core i7 8700K’s are topping out at speeds of 5.3GHz. Of course, we will have to wait for the official reviews of the 8700k to see whether these rumors hold value or not.

What we do know for certain is that Intel is increasing core counts across the board on its new 8th Gen Coffee Lake CPUs. Core i3s are now full quad cores, and Core i5s and I7s are now equipped with 6 cores. This marks the first time we’ve seen a complete core count increase across all CPUs from Intel since the Core 2 series.

************************************************************************

What this Means for Ryzen:
Fortunately for AMD, Ryzen still has a thread count advantage over Intel, this alone still makes most Ryzen chips very competitive against Coffee Lake. What we should see according to specs alone is more of a tie between Ryzen and Coffee Lake when it comes to multithreaded applications and multitasking.

Gaming wise, Intel will still take the lead as Intel apparently is still using the Ring Bus architecture for their 8th Gen. CPUs versus Intel’s new Mesh architecture which is implemented in Skylake-X. This means that core-to-core latency will be almost as fast as Kaby Lake, so gaming performance will not be hindered compared to AMD’s Infinity Fabric which generally has higher latencies due to cores needing to communicate across CCX’s.

What this Means for Skylake-X & Kaby Lake-X:
Not everything is fine and dandy for Intel, with Coffee Lake they face major cannibalization issues between their mainstream and HEDT platforms. Specifically I am talking about Kaby Lake-X, the Core i5 7640X and Core i7 7740X which are on the X299 platform but cannot take advantage of any of X299s main features like quad channel memory support and high amounts of PCI-E lanes. Lets take a look at the specs:

Core i7-7800K
Cores = 6/8
Cache = 12MB
IMC = Dual Channel
PCIE Lanes = 16
Z370 Motherboards = Low Cost to Entry

Core i7-7740X
Cores = 4/8
Cache = 8MB
IMC = Dual Channel
PCIE Lanes = 16
X299 Motherboards = Expensive to Entry (Average price for X299 motherboards are around $300)

The only place the 7740X wins is in it’s base clock of 4.3ghz, but even then it’s negligible since the 8700K has a 4.7GHz boost clock while the 7740X only has a boost clock of 4.5GHz.
So as you can see, Kaby Lake-X is completely dead after just several months from launch.

Skylake-X could also take some hits but shouldn’t be as severe as Kaby Lake-X. The Core i7-7800X will most likely get punished by the 8700K as it has an identical core count to the 8700k, granted it does have quad channel memory support and has more PCI-E lanes than Coffee Lake CPUs, but it share a very similar latency deficit like Ryzen due to Intel’s new Mesh architecture. So if you're a gamer and a content creator, the 8700K most likely will be no brainer. Only those who need the extra PCI-E lanes and quad channel memory will buy the 7800X over the 8700k.

We could also see the 7820X Octo Core CPU being eaten by the 8700K in the market if the 8700K’s higher clock speeds can make up enough performance for the price vs the 7820X. But we will have to wait for the benchmarks to see what will become of Skylake-X.

*****************************************************************
I hope you enjoyed this more “rumor mill” type of post, it won’t be in every megathread, however it seemed appropriate for Coffee Lake now that we know official specs.

Thanks for reading! Let us know your thoughts on Coffee Lake and what you expect in its performance!
Reply to TechyInAZ
379 answers Last reply
More about intel coffee lake 8th generation megathread faq resources
  1. Thanks for this thread. Was waiting for a long time. :)

    Intel Vs AMD segmentation



    Source... https://www.extremetech.com/computing/256378-intels-coffee-lake-refresh-offers-six-cores-goes-sale-october-5
    Reply to Hellfire13
  2. Wait - so both Intel and AMD have X399 motherboards? That's not going to get confusing or anything.
    Reply to g-unit1111
  3. Hellfire13 said:
    Thanks for this thread. Was waiting for a long time. :)

    Intel Vs AMD segmentation



    Source... https://www.extremetech.com/computing/256378-intels-coffee-lake-refresh-offers-six-cores-goes-sale-october-5


    why did they use 1700x instead? it $348 on amazon, unless that the launch price
    Reply to rgd1101
  4. g-unit1111 said:
    Wait - so both Intel and AMD have X399 motherboards? That's not going to get confusing or anything.


    No. SkyLake-X mobos = X299
    Threadripper mobos = X399
    Reply to DRagor
  5. Also a typo comparing the i7-7800k to the i7-7740X, should be the i7-8700k
    Reply to Eximo
  6. Looks like I'm going to have to call this round in favor of Intel.

    Intel, using shear horsepower and ring bus, probably beats their AMD counterparts even in multi-threaded workloads even though AMD has more cores/treads. Heavily threaded may still go to AMD but my guess is it'll be close there too.

    Can't wait for comparisons to see how it works out.
    Looks like we will start trading blows with each release. Should get good now!

    I think it should be the R7 1700X on the list, not the 1700 though. That's seems to be a better comparison on price and performance.
    Reply to ibjeepr
  7. DRagor said:
    g-unit1111 said:
    Wait - so both Intel and AMD have X399 motherboards? That's not going to get confusing or anything.


    No. SkyLake-X mobos = X299
    Threadripper mobos = X399


    That must be a typo in the OP because I'm reading it again and it says X399.
    Reply to g-unit1111
  8. Covfefe Lake!

    And how sure is the release date? I read October 4th?

    Cheers!
    Reply to Yuka
  9. Yuka said:
    Covfefe Lake!

    And how sure is the release date? I read October 4th?

    Cheers!


    I've seen Oct. 5 everywhere, haven't seen the 4th listed.
    Reply to ibjeepr
  10. g-unit1111 said:
    DRagor said:
    g-unit1111 said:
    Wait - so both Intel and AMD have X399 motherboards? That's not going to get confusing or anything.


    No. SkyLake-X mobos = X299
    Threadripper mobos = X399


    That must be a typo in the OP because I'm reading it again and it says X399.


    You are correct
    "Specifically I am talking about Kaby Lake-X, the Core i5 7640X and Core i7 7740X which are on the X399"
    Reply to ibjeepr
  11. g-unit1111 said:

    That must be a typo in the OP because I'm reading it again and it says X399.


    Yep. Not the only one, as a matter of fact.
    As for confusion, I would say worse one is going to be X370 for AMD AM4 and Z370 for Coffee Lake. It's just one letter of difference ...
    Reply to DRagor
  12. rgd1101 said:
    Hellfire13 said:
    Thanks for this thread. Was waiting for a long time. :)

    Intel Vs AMD segmentation



    Source... https://www.extremetech.com/computing/256378-intels-coffee-lake-refresh-offers-six-cores-goes-sale-october-5


    why did they use 1700x instead? it $348 on amazon, unless that the launch price


    Probably because 1700 is more value as it comes cheaper with equal potential when OCed.
    Reply to Hellfire13
  13. Intel has a z390 on its roadmap somewhere in the 2nd half of 2018... https://segmentnext.com/2017/09/11/z390-motherboards-will-debut-2018/

    "This bit of new information regarding Z390 motherboards has been revealed by a leaked roadmap that has found its way to the internet. Furthermore, only the high-end Z370 chipset motherboards will be released this year and you will have to wait for the cheaper CPUs and motherboards to come out next year."
    Reply to Hellfire13
  14. ibjeepr said:
    Yuka said:
    Covfefe Lake!

    And how sure is the release date? I read October 4th?

    Cheers!


    I've seen Oct. 5 everywhere, haven't seen the 4th listed.


    Ah, sorry, yes. The 5th of Oct 2017.

    And I also remember the new Z boards will be 370 in numbering. I wonder what Intel will do for the X line though...

    Cheers!
    Reply to Yuka
  15. Yuka said:
    Covfefe Lake!

    And how sure is the release date? I read October 4th?

    Cheers!


    :lol:
    Reply to g-unit1111
  16. g-unit1111 said:
    Wait - so both Intel and AMD have X399 motherboards? That's not going to get confusing or anything.


    Yeap, sorry peoples...fixed that typo.
    Reply to TechyInAZ
  17. juanrga said:


    Numbers look promising. :)

    Wonder what z390 will bring over z370.
    Reply to Hellfire13
  18. Hellfire13 said:
    juanrga said:


    Numbers look promising. :)

    Wonder what z390 will bring over z370.


    From my understanding, mainstream 8C/16T CPUs. A leak seems to confirm as much.

    https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/eurocom_rep_states_that_intel_s_x390_chipset_will_support_8c_16th_cpus/1

    AMD seems to have lite a fire under a giant. About time we start to see competition and performance come back to the market. I wish Intel would stop the new chipset every/everyother CPU launch game but they have been banging that drum for as long as I can remember.
    Reply to atomicWAR
  19. atomicWAR said:
    Hellfire13 said:
    juanrga said:


    Numbers look promising. :)

    Wonder what z390 will bring over z370.


    From my understanding, mainstream 8C/16T CPUs. A leak seems to confirm as much.

    https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/eurocom_rep_states_that_intel_s_x390_chipset_will_support_8c_16th_cpus/1

    AMD seems to have lite a fire under a giant. About time we start to see competition and performance come back to the market. I wish Intel would stop the new chipset every/everyother CPU launch game but they have been banging that drum for as long as I can remember.


    I'm curious as to what AMD will fireback with when Cannonlake/icelake (whatever it's gona be for x390) does appear with those 8/16 core CPUs.
    Reply to TechyInAZ
  20. TechyInAZ said:
    atomicWAR said:
    Hellfire13 said:
    juanrga said:


    Numbers look promising. :)

    Wonder what z390 will bring over z370.


    From my understanding, mainstream 8C/16T CPUs. A leak seems to confirm as much.

    https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/eurocom_rep_states_that_intel_s_x390_chipset_will_support_8c_16th_cpus/1

    AMD seems to have lite a fire under a giant. About time we start to see competition and performance come back to the market. I wish Intel would stop the new chipset every/everyother CPU launch game but they have been banging that drum for as long as I can remember.


    I'm curious as to what AMD will fireback with when Cannonlake/icelake (whatever it's gona be for x390) does appear with those 8/16 core CPUs.


    Well, right now we expect 12nm, which looks like a 14nm+ refresh. 15% more density(transistors), and >10% performance. More transistors means better IPC. Based on there 14nm frequency restrictions hard to say how much clock speed will raise until we know more about the improvements. Beyond that we have 7nm(1h 2019), which is what we hope is going to be a great node that offers >40% performance or >60% power reduction over the current 14nm Zen. TSMC is releasing 7nm this year, and is similar to Intel's 10nm. Samsung is an early adopter of EUV, and has the most aggressive node map, and at some point may play a roll in all this with 7n 2018, 6-5nm 2019, and 4nm 2020. AMD is tied to GlobalFoundries, but at an expense can move to another foundry until the contract ends in 2020. Rumor of AMD involvement with helping create A.I. for Tesla coincide with the choice of GlobalFoundries 12nm, which from a consumer desktop CPU vantage point doesn't look all that great compared to Intel's offerings. Never the less it's an exciting time for technology, and I can't wait to see how it unfolds.

    Node Warfare?
    GlobalFoundries unveils 12nm finFET process; foundries jockey for position on way to next full node.
    SEPTEMBER 20TH, 2017 - BY: MARK LAPEDUS

    Quote:

    GlobalFoundries uncorked a 12nm finFET process, which the company said will provide a 15% increase in density and more than 10% improvement in performance over the foundry’s existing 14nm process.

    This is GlobalFoundries’ second 12nm process. It announced a 12nm FD-SOI process called 12FDX last September, although it first mentioned a 12nm process back in July of last year.

    The announcement adds to the flood of process node numbers in semiconductor manufacturing these days. The reasoning behind all of this activity is that even though 7nm—the next full node—will be introduced next year, it will take time before that process is mature enough for commercial production. Foundries are trying to provide enough options to hold onto existing customers until that happens, while also tapping potential customers in new markets.

    The new business involves sectors such as automotive, IoT, communications infrastructure, and artificial intelligence/machine learning. GlobalFoundries, for example, is taking aim at the automotive and RF/analog markets with its new process. The 12LP process is expected to meet Automotive Grade 2 qualification next quarter, which under AEC-Q100 means it will operate at temperatures between -40°C and +105°C, and it is being targeted for transceivers in 6GHz wireless networks.

    “It builds on 14nm,” said Sanjay Jha, CEO of GlobalFoundries. “It pushes new designs and constructs.”

    He noted that shipments are expected to begin in the first half of next year.

    Still, there are now so many process node numbers out there that it’s becoming difficult to sort through them all, a task made all the more difficult because the numbers don’t match up from one foundry to the next. Intel’s 14nm process, for example, has double the number of transistors as TSMC’s 16nm, while Intel’s 10nm process is roughly the same as TSMC’s forthcoming 7nm.

    Joanne Itow, managing director for manufacturing at Semico Research, said foundry customers have to do their homework to make sense of all of this.

    “You have to do a lot of analysis of what process works with your products,” she said, noting that each foundry appears to be taking a base process and then proliferating it. She described GlobalFoundries move as a small tweak that gives customers new options.

    And there is certainly plenty of node tweaking underway. TSMC unveiled a 12nm process this month, while Samsung introduced an 11nm process. In addition, Samsung announced 8nm, 7nm, 6nm, 5nm, and 4nm finFET processes in May, and said it plans to introduce 18nm FD-SOI in 2019.


    Samsung Details Foundry Roadmap
    by Scotten Jones
    Published on 06-09-2017 08:00 AM


    Edit: AMD to launch 12nm Ryzen in February 2018, says mobo makers
    Monica Chen, Taipei; Joseph Tsai, DIGITIMES [Wednesday 27 September 2017]
    Reply to goldstone77
  21. Hellfire13 said:
    Thanks for this thread. Was waiting for a long time. :)

    Intel Vs AMD segmentation



    Source... https://www.extremetech.com/computing/256378-intels-coffee-lake-refresh-offers-six-cores-goes-sale-october-5


    This information from the same article:
    Quote:

    More Cores, Higher Prices
    Several of the new chips are more expensive than the parts they replace. The Core i7-7700K launched at $305; the new Core i7-8700K is $359. The Core i7-7700 had a launch price of $272, and the new core is $303. The Core i5-7600K was $217; the Core i5-8600K is $257. In short, you may be getting more cores, but you’re definitely paying for them.

    https://pcpartpicker.com/
    Prices for Ryzen processor as of 9.28.2017

    New AMD Ryzen 3 1300X 4-Core 3.5GHz (3.7GHz Turbo) Socket AM4 65W YD130XBBAEBOX
    Brand new. Sealed. Limit 5 per buyer
    $113.99 Free Shipping


    This is what the chart would look like with current Ryzen prices. Note that I did not round up to the nearest dollar.

    The Ryzen 1600@$195.89 still offers the better value compared to the 1600X, and comes with a CPU cooler. And would match up against the Core i5-8600K@$257, and be just above the Core i5-8400@$182.
    Reply to goldstone77
  22. goldstone77 said:
    TechyInAZ said:
    atomicWAR said:
    Hellfire13 said:
    juanrga said:


    Numbers look promising. :)

    Wonder what z390 will bring over z370.


    From my understanding, mainstream 8C/16T CPUs. A leak seems to confirm as much.

    https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/eurocom_rep_states_that_intel_s_x390_chipset_will_support_8c_16th_cpus/1

    AMD seems to have lite a fire under a giant. About time we start to see competition and performance come back to the market. I wish Intel would stop the new chipset every/everyother CPU launch game but they have been banging that drum for as long as I can remember.


    I'm curious as to what AMD will fireback with when Cannonlake/icelake (whatever it's gona be for x390) does appear with those 8/16 core CPUs.


    Well, right now we expect 12nm(~2h 2018), which looks like a 14nm+ refresh. 15% more density(transistors), and >10% performance. More transistors means better IPC. Based on there 14nm frequency restrictions hard to say how much clock speed will raise until we know more about the improvements. Beyond that we have 7nm(1h 2019), which is what we hope is going to be a great node that offers >40% performance or >60% power reduction over the current 14nm Zen. TSMC is releasing 7nm this year, and is similar to Intel's 10nm. Samsung is an early adopter of EUV, and has the most aggressive node map, and at some point may play a roll in all this with 7n 2018, 6-5nm 2019, and 4nm 2020. AMD is tied to GlobalFoundries, but at an expense can move to another foundry until the contract ends in 2020. Rumor of AMD involvement with helping create A.I. for Tesla coincide with the choice of GlobalFoundries 12nm, which from a consumer desktop CPU vantage point doesn't look all that great compared to Intel's offerings. Never the less it's an exciting time for technology, and I can't wait to see how it unfolds.


    The up to 15% more density and more than 10% performance marketing claims are using TSMC 16nm as baseline,. Glofo doesn't use its current 14nm node as baseline, because the increases that 12LP bring are minimal. 12LP is a marketing name. AMD will be lucky if gets 5% higher clocks with Pinnacle Ridge.

    The IPC is the same. Pinnacle Ridge has the same IPC than Summit Ridge. Only clocks change.

    7nm Glofo is expected in 2019, but there is no confirmation it is coming int he first half. The claims of >40% performance or >60% power reduction over the current 14nm Zen are idealized claims based in a single-transistor measurement at optimal points. Real-life improvements will be smaller. AMD products will get only a fraction of those percentages.
    Reply to juanrga
  23. TechyInAZ said:
    atomicWAR said:
    Hellfire13 said:
    juanrga said:


    Numbers look promising. :)

    Wonder what z390 will bring over z370.


    From my understanding, mainstream 8C/16T CPUs. A leak seems to confirm as much.

    https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/eurocom_rep_states_that_intel_s_x390_chipset_will_support_8c_16th_cpus/1

    AMD seems to have lite a fire under a giant. About time we start to see competition and performance come back to the market. I wish Intel would stop the new chipset every/everyother CPU launch game but they have been banging that drum for as long as I can remember.


    I'm curious as to what AMD will fireback with when Cannonlake/icelake (whatever it's gona be for x390) does appear with those 8/16 core CPUs.


    For 2018/2019 AMD will still rely on 4-core APUs with Zen.

    Reply to juanrga
  24. juanrga said:
    goldstone77 said:
    TechyInAZ said:
    atomicWAR said:
    Hellfire13 said:
    juanrga said:


    Numbers look promising. :)

    Wonder what z390 will bring over z370.


    From my understanding, mainstream 8C/16T CPUs. A leak seems to confirm as much.

    https://www.overclock3d.net/news/cpu_mainboard/eurocom_rep_states_that_intel_s_x390_chipset_will_support_8c_16th_cpus/1

    AMD seems to have lite a fire under a giant. About time we start to see competition and performance come back to the market. I wish Intel would stop the new chipset every/everyother CPU launch game but they have been banging that drum for as long as I can remember.


    I'm curious as to what AMD will fireback with when Cannonlake/icelake (whatever it's gona be for x390) does appear with those 8/16 core CPUs.


    Well, right now we expect 12nm(~2h 2018), which looks like a 14nm+ refresh. 15% more density(transistors), and >10% performance. More transistors means better IPC. Based on there 14nm frequency restrictions hard to say how much clock speed will raise until we know more about the improvements. Beyond that we have 7nm(1h 2019), which is what we hope is going to be a great node that offers >40% performance or >60% power reduction over the current 14nm Zen. TSMC is releasing 7nm this year, and is similar to Intel's 10nm. Samsung is an early adopter of EUV, and has the most aggressive node map, and at some point may play a roll in all this with 7n 2018, 6-5nm 2019, and 4nm 2020. AMD is tied to GlobalFoundries, but at an expense can move to another foundry until the contract ends in 2020. Rumor of AMD involvement with helping create A.I. for Tesla coincide with the choice of GlobalFoundries 12nm, which from a consumer desktop CPU vantage point doesn't look all that great compared to Intel's offerings. Never the less it's an exciting time for technology, and I can't wait to see how it unfolds.


    The up to 15% more density and more than 10% performance marketing claims are using TSMC 16nm as baseline,. Glofo doesn't use its current 14nm node as baseline, because the increases that 12LP bring are minimal. 12LP is a marketing name. AMD will be lucky if gets 5% higher clocks with Pinnacle Ridge.

    The IPC is the same. Pinnacle Ridge has the same IPC than Summit Ridge. Only clocks change.

    7nm Glofo is expected in 2019, but there is no confirmation it is coming int he first half. The claims of >40% performance or >60% power reduction over the current 14nm Zen are idealized claims based in a single-transistor measurement at optimal points. Real-life improvements will be smaller. AMD products will get only a fraction of those percentages.


    What changes are being made to Zen 14nm that will enable them to increase the frequency? And how do these changes allow for the Automotive Grade 2 qualification?
    Quote:

    The 12LP process is expected to meet Automotive Grade 2 qualification next quarter, which under AEC-Q100 means it will operate at temperatures between -40°C and +105°C, and it is being targeted for transceivers in 6GHz wireless networks.
    Reply to goldstone77
  25. goldstone77 said:
    What changes are being made to Zen 14nm that will enable them to increase the frequency?


    No change in the microarchitecture. PinnacleRidge uses the same Zen muarch than SummitRidge. 14nm+ is simply a more mature process lowering the voltages and allowing to get slightly higher clocks in the same power.
    Reply to juanrga
  26. juanrga said:
    goldstone77 said:
    What changes are being made to Zen 14nm that will enable them to increase the frequency?


    No change in the microarchitecture. PinnacleRidge uses the same Zen muarch than SummitRidge. 14nm+ is simply a more mature process lowering the voltages and allowing to get slightly higher clocks in the same power.


    And how do these changes allow for the Automotive Grade 2 qualification?
    Quote:

    The 12LP process is expected to meet Automotive Grade 2 qualification next quarter, which under AEC-Q100 means it will operate at temperatures between -40°C and +105°C, and it is being targeted for transceivers in 6GHz wireless networks.
    Reply to goldstone77
  27. I do hope the new 12nm is optimized enough so that it brings way higher clock speeds. Even if AMD just did that one simple thing, just increasing core clocks to match coffee lake, it would win in nearly everything hands down.
    Reply to TechyInAZ
  28. Quote:
    The Ryzen 1600@$195.89 still offers the better value compared to the 1600X, and comes with a CPU cooler. And would match up against the Core i5-8600K@$257, and be just above the Core i5-8400@$182.


    Not even close. And the upcoming benchmarks will prove that. :D
    Reply to Hellfire13
  29. Hellfire13 said:
    Quote:
    The Ryzen 1600@$195.89 still offers the better value compared to the 1600X, and comes with a CPU cooler. And would match up against the Core i5-8600K@$257, and be just above the Core i5-8400@$182.


    Not even close. And the upcoming benchmarks will prove that. :D


    Maybe, the wording was misleading.
    Quote:

    The Ryzen 1600@$195.89 still offers the better value compared to the 1600X, and comes with a CPU cooler.

    Essentially, the same processor capable of reaching the same frequency, and the 1600 is cheaper and comes with a CPU cooler.
    Quote:

    And would match up against the Core i5-8600K@$257, and be just above the Core i5-8400@$182.

    Price wise and in multithreading the 1600@$195.89 matches up very well compared to the new 6 core 6 thread i5's, and will beat them in multi-threading performance. Of course the new 6 cores are showing strong single thread performance, and the i5-8600K will likely be choice of many gamers.
    Reply to goldstone77
  30. Considering I was about to buy an R7-1700 or an R5-1600x (bc I am afraid to OC), I may now have to wait and see if that i5-8600k wins in benchmarks.

    Call me old-fashioned but I like when there was a clear winner. Made it easier to make a purchase when you know as little as I do.
    Reply to rob.salewytsch
  31. rob.salewytsch said:
    Considering I was about to buy an R7-1700 or an R5-1600x (bc I am afraid to OC), I may now have to wait and see if that i5-8600k wins in benchmarks.

    Call me old-fashioned but I like when there was a clear winner. Made it easier to make a purchase when you know as little as I do.


    If you want a clear winner you'll need a clear definition of what you want it to win at. I'm currently waiting for the 8600k benchmarks as well but really just for gaming. If you are looking for heavily multi-threaded programs Ryzen probably still has the edge. I'm thinking for gaming 6 cores on a ring bus should be a clear winner and 6 cores should be enough for gaming for a few years. While a few current games do like Ryzen's more threads I don't expect that to be a major factor.
    Reply to ibjeepr
  32. So even after Ryzen caught Intel with their pants down, they're still making us pay a premium for an unlocked multiplier?

    Basic vs XFR Ryzen I can agree with because that's binning. Now if the regular ones weren't unlocked, I think I'd be a bit more irritated. How does Intel think that they're still top dog when this is their sales strategy?

    That aside, have we heard about the thermal material they're using? Still just crappy paste?
    Reply to weberdarren97
  33. No, Coffee Lake Will Not Run In Z270 Motherboards (And Here’s Why)
    by Paul Alcorn September 27, 2017 at 2:15 PM

    Quote:

    Coffee Lake hasn't officially arrived, but Intel has confirmed enthusiasts' fears and information we ferreted out from public statements from motherboard vendors: The processors will not be backward compatible with the Z270 or Z170 chipsets. The forced move to the Z370 platform, even though Coffee Lake processors drop into the physically identical LGA1551 socket found on previous-generation motherboards, stands in stark contrast to AMD's Socket AM4 strategy, which the company will support with all new processors until 2020. AMD announced AM4 last September, and it also supports AMD's 7th-generation Bristol Ridge (the Carrizo-based APU).
    Kaby Lake processors brought most of the iterative improvements over Skylake that we've come to expect, but you could purchase one of the new fancy processors and slap it into an existing Z170 motherboard and enjoy the increased performance with a minimal investment, albeit after a BIOS update.


    Quote:

    In contrast, Coffee Lake offers Intel's biggest generational performance leap we've seen in years, if the company's claims hold true. Suddenly we have quad-core i3s and hexa-core i5s and i7s, breaking Intel's insistence upon merely offering slightly increased clock speeds (and perhaps improved integrated graphics) for its gen-on-gen releases. Of course, there will be a slight price increase associated with the step up to more cores, but the ability to drop a new processor into the Z270 motherboard you bought eight months ago (at the earliest) would be nice.
    But Intel isn't providing backward compatibility with either of the older LGA1151 motherboards (Z170 and Z270) and, curiously, your only upgrade path through the end of the year comes in the form of pricey Z370 motherboards—value-oriented B350 or H370 motherboards will not debut until next year.


    Quote:

    Intel provided a few technical reasons for the lack of backward compatibility, with the requirement for an improved power delivery subsystem being one of the most important. We know that the existing Z270 motherboards can provide enough power to push quad-core processors, as we see now with the Coffee Lake Core i3 processors, but Intel noted that the additional two cores proffered on the i5 and i7 would require more power.
    Although TDP isn't a direct measurement of power consumption, it is a decent indicator. The Coffee Lake i7-8700K weighs in with a TDP of 95W compared to Kaby Lake i7-7700K's 91W rating. A small increase, sure, but we could see larger deltas during overclocking. Intel says it improved the package power delivery to offset the increased overclocking power requirements for the six-core models, and we will certainly quantify the difference in package power draw during our review. The Coffee Lake processors also support per-core overclocking, a feature that wasn't included in the Kaby Lake era, but they still don't allow for fine-grained per-core voltage or P-State settings.Intel noted that the Z370 motherboards have improved memory routing to support DDR4-2666, a slight increase over Kaby Lake's DDR4-2400. Existing Kaby Lake motherboards easily support memory overclocking well beyond DDR4-2666, as any overclocker can attest, but Intel also says it has baked other improvements into Coffee Lake processors. Intel expanded the memory multipliers to support up to 8400 MT/s and added a real-time memory latency control feature.
    Whether the existing Z270 motherboards, many of which offer beefy power delivery, could potentially satisfy the needs of the Coffee Lake processors will be a hot-button debate for some time to come. We've requested additional details from Intel regarding the socket and pin-out, but we await further details.
    The 300-series chipset doesn't offer any new features; even the TDP remains the same, which suggests the 300-series chipset is merely a Z270 refresh. Outside of new LED functionality or other third-party additions, there would be little reason to upgrade a Kaby Lake system to a newer motherboard, but the option would be nice. However, Kaby Lake processors will also not work on 300-series motherboards. Intel indicated the decision to eliminate Kaby Lake compatibility was due, at least in part, to requests from motherboard vendors that the company make a "clean split." For motherboard vendors, this removes the burden of adding support for Kaby Lake (and the requisite validation) during a time when most motherboard vendors are already stretched to their engineering resource limits due to rapid fire Intel and AMD launches.
    The requirement for a new chipset also comes hot on the heels of rumors that Intel will have Z390 motherboards coming to market next year that support eight-core processors. Even though the similar naming convention would lead us to believe Z390 motherboards will work with Coffee Lake chips, it's hard to speculate until we know more. Intel is placing the Kaby Lake refresh, Coffee Lake, and Cannon Lake processors under the 8th-generation umbrella, so it's possible the Z390 motherboard will support Cannon Lake processors. Will Z370 motherboards support Cannon Lake processors? That's anyone's guess.

    The staggered 300-series roll out (there won't be any H370 or B350 motherboards available until next year) also means that enthusiasts interested in Intel's locked Coffee Lake models will still have to pay extra for Z370 motherboards that support overclocking.
    There has been plenty of speculation that Intel's Coffee Lake lineup is a direct reaction to AMD's Ryzen processors, but given the extended nature of processor development, the processors have likely been in the works for several years. While Coffee Lake may not be a knee-jerk reaction, the fact that Intel doesn't have the full lineup of motherboard options at launch certainly makes it appear the company pulled the timeline in significantly.
    Reply to goldstone77
  34. This part in the OP "The good news is AMD will be launching new CPUs on the 7nm process by next year, so hopefully we’ll see a big jump in performance soon." is wrong.
    Reply to juanrga
  35. What's the chance of someone hacking a z270 bios to allow coffee lake processors? 0?
    Reply to minigaming
  36. minigaming said:
    What's the chance of someone hacking a z270 bios to allow coffee lake processors? 0?

    Gamer's Nexus talked briefly about it. Earlier engineering boards for Z270 did support inter-compatibility.

    Click here for link
    Reply to goldstone77
  37. goldstone77 said:
    minigaming said:
    What's the chance of someone hacking a z270 bios to allow coffee lake processors? 0?

    Gamer's Nexus talked briefly about it. Earlier engineering boards for Z270 did support inter-compatibility.

    Click here for link



    Thanks. Hopefully someone can make a bios update for my Gigabyte Aorus Z270X-Gaming 7 motherboard so I can upgrade the 7700k to the 8700k. There is no way this board isn't capable of the power delivery needs claimed by intel. Otherwise I'll just stay with the 7700k for a while longer.
    Reply to minigaming
  38. minigaming said:
    goldstone77 said:
    minigaming said:
    What's the chance of someone hacking a z270 bios to allow coffee lake processors? 0?

    Gamer's Nexus talked briefly about it. Earlier engineering boards for Z270 did support inter-compatibility.

    Click here for link



    Thanks. Hopefully someone can make a bios update for my Gigabyte Aorus Z270X-Gaming 7 motherboard so I can upgrade the 7700k to the 8700k. There is no way this board isn't capable of the power delivery needs claimed by intel. Otherwise I'll just stay with the 7700k for a while longer.


    Depends. We don't know all the details of the new VRMs and stuff like that. I'm guessing yeah most high high end z270 boards should, but maybe there's one or two things that insure incompatibility.
    Reply to TechyInAZ
  39. I will say this a second time: the next quote in the OP "The good news is AMD will be launching new CPUs on the 7nm process by next year, so hopefully we’ll see a big jump in performance soon." is wrong. There is no 7nm AMD chips next year. Please any mod edit the OP.
    Reply to juanrga
  40. juanrga said:
    I will say this a second time: the next quote in the OP "The good news is AMD will be launching new CPUs on the 7nm process by next year, so hopefully we’ll see a big jump in performance soon." is wrong. There is no 7nm AMD chips next year. Please any mod edit the OP.


    GLOBALFOUNDRIES is Hitting on all Cylinders
    by Scotten Jones
    Published on 09-28-2017 05:00 PM

    Quote:

    7LP (Leading performance) is GF's leading edge 7nm FinFET process. Whereas GF licensed Samsung's FinFET process at 14nm, at 7nm GF is developing their own process. Device performance at 7nm is >40% better than at 14nm and total power is >60% lower than 14nm. 7nm will provide 17 million gates/mm2 and a 30% die cost reduction versus 14nm with a >45% cost reduction for target segments. The PDK is available now and risk production is on track for the first half of 2018. Figure 3 presents the 7LP platform.

    Reply to goldstone77
  41. First review of CoffeeLake

    https://www.techpowerup.com/237434/core-i7-8700k-reviewed-by-lab501

    My former thoughts about CB15 score confirmed:

    juanrga said:
    1262 isn't the score for the i7-7800k. The real score will be close to 1500. Also expereview is not strictly testing at stock settings, memory is underclocked on CoffeeLake.


    i7-7800k does 1520 points on stock settings.

    Resume of the review: 6C 7800k wins to the 8C 1800X on most multithreaded workloads and when loses, as in CineBench or POV-Ray does by a very small margin. CoffeeLake is so fast in single thread and less threaded benches that would be illegal. :pt1cable:
    Reply to juanrga
  42. One thing is when Glofo plans to start risk production of the 7nm node. Another thing is when volume production will be ready and still another thing is when AMD will release a 7nm product. The updated AMD roadmap is available in many sites and forums. It is also available in this thread. AMD 7nm CPUs are coming in 2019, not next year. Please some mod edit the OP and removes the next incorrect information: "The good news is AMD will be launching new CPUs on the 7nm process by next year, so hopefully we’ll see a big jump in performance soon."
    Reply to juanrga
  43. Reply to Hellfire13
  44. juanrga said:
    First review of CoffeeLake

    https://www.techpowerup.com/237434/core-i7-8700k-reviewed-by-lab501

    My former thoughts about CB15 score confirmed:

    juanrga said:
    1262 isn't the score for the i7-7800k. The real score will be close to 1500. Also expereview is not strictly testing at stock settings, memory is underclocked on CoffeeLake.


    i7-7800k does 1520 points on stock settings.

    Resume of the review: 6C 7800k wins to the 8C 1800X on most multithreaded workloads and when loses, as in CineBench or POV-Ray does by a very small margin. CoffeeLake is so fast in single thread and less threaded benches that would be illegal. :pt1cable:


    Don't forget the salt, since those are not using official samples nor official release CPUs.

    Still positive none the less.

    Cheers!
    Reply to Yuka
  45. juanrga said:
    One thing is when Glofo plans to start risk production of the 7nm node. Another thing is when volume production will be ready and still another thing is when AMD will release a 7nm product. The updated AMD roadmap is available in many sites and forums. It is also available in this thread. AMD 7nm CPUs are coming in 2019, not next year. Please some mod edit the OP and removes the next incorrect information: "The good news is AMD will be launching new CPUs on the 7nm process by next year, so hopefully we’ll see a big jump in performance soon."


    I agree the current map suggests AMD plans 2019 for 7nm. How long after risk production would you say a full ramp up in production take without any problems? 2H2018?
    Reply to goldstone77
  46. juanrga said:
    I will say this a second time: the next quote in the OP "The good news is AMD will be launching new CPUs on the 7nm process by next year, so hopefully we’ll see a big jump in performance soon." is wrong. There is no 7nm AMD chips next year. Please any mod edit the OP.


    Sorry, fixed. Thanks for that.
    Reply to TechyInAZ
  47. goldstone77 said:
    juanrga said:
    One thing is when Glofo plans to start risk production of the 7nm node. Another thing is when volume production will be ready and still another thing is when AMD will release a 7nm product. The updated AMD roadmap is available in many sites and forums. It is also available in this thread. AMD 7nm CPUs are coming in 2019, not next year. Please some mod edit the OP and removes the next incorrect information: "The good news is AMD will be launching new CPUs on the 7nm process by next year, so hopefully we’ll see a big jump in performance soon."


    I agree the current map suggests AMD plans 2019 for 7nm. How long after risk production would you say a full ramp up in production take without any problems? 2H2018?


    Track record goes, unfortunately, against that being the case or even giving them the benefit of the doubt to be the case. I would most definitely be impressed if they do push forward the dates, but I won't expect it in the least.

    For now, officially unless they update it, it's 2019.

    Cheers!
    Reply to Yuka
  48. minigaming said:
    goldstone77 said:
    minigaming said:
    What's the chance of someone hacking a z270 bios to allow coffee lake processors? 0?

    Gamer's Nexus talked briefly about it. Earlier engineering boards for Z270 did support inter-compatibility.

    Click here for link



    Thanks. Hopefully someone can make a bios update for my Gigabyte Aorus Z270X-Gaming 7 motherboard so I can upgrade the 7700k to the 8700k. There is no way this board isn't capable of the power delivery needs claimed by intel. Otherwise I'll just stay with the 7700k for a while longer.


    The chances of doing it successfully are zero. The pin configurations are different, Socket 1150 had 46 reserved pins. Socket 1150v2 has, I believe, 21 reserved pins. Not only are their 25 newly activated pins, but many of the other pin locations/functions have been changed. If you install a Coffee Lake S processor into a Socket 1151, it will probably be fried. The best thing that can happen is it simply won't work. The reverse is also true. Do not be the one who attempts it.

    Intel has gone out of their way, again and again, to explain this. Why so many people can't understand is a complete mystery to me.
    Reply to manleysteele
Ask a new question Answer

Read More

Intel Coffee Lake CPUs