Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

I have an inspiron 6000, with the WXGA screen.

I was curious----is this driving the screen with a regular SVGA analog line
discipline, or are notebook screens inherently digitally driven?

Thanks.


--
Everythinginlifeisrealative.Apingpongballseemssmalluntilsomeoneramsitupyournose.

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Thomas G. Marshall wrote:
^
> I have an inspiron 6000, with the WXGA screen.
>
> I was curious----is this driving the screen with a regular SVGA
> analog line discipline, or are notebook screens inherently digitally
> driven?

They are digitally driven, but not with DVI but with a proprietary
system depending on the panel...

Benjamin

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 04:21:53 GMT, "Thomas G. Marshall"
<tgm2tothe10thpower@replacetextwithnumber.hotmail.com> wrote:


>
>Panel-specific line discipline?

Each maker sets their own standars. Many are very close (and some
match) DVI standards. However, connectors are going to be different,
some signals may be different, etc.

>
>Having thunk about this for some time, I'm still confused. Do I have the
>ability to change the video card in my notebook, just like I can with the
>desktop?

Absolutely not. 1. the video adapter is built into the MB. 2. No slots
for a new adapter. 3. Should you get an adapter in there, no room for
the cable to outside monitor. 4. No chance you could interface with
the built-in LCD screen.

>If so, isn't there some unifying standard for digital signal
>output (like, oh, DVI-D or DVI-I), so that I need not get, for example, a
>card dedicated to and hardwired specifically for the Dell's various screens?

What you'd really need is a new notebook... <g> Say you are
determined, and there is a notebook that has the video adapter you
wish to use, and say the motherboard matches the one in your notebook,
you might be able to do a complete MB swap. But, why bother, it would
take more work and money than a new one.

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"PeterD" <peter2@hipson.net> wrote in message
news:er6oi1h2gh8jevc9ldps59b30svp7epuni@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 04:21:53 GMT, "Thomas G. Marshall"
> <tgm2tothe10thpower@replacetextwithnumber.hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
>>
>>Panel-specific line discipline?
>
> Each maker sets their own standars. Many are very close (and some
> match) DVI standards. However, connectors are going to be different,
> some signals may be different, etc.
>
>>
>>Having thunk about this for some time, I'm still confused. Do I have the
>>ability to change the video card in my notebook, just like I can with the
>>desktop?
>
> Absolutely not. 1. the video adapter is built into the MB. 2. No slots
> for a new adapter. 3. Should you get an adapter in there, no room for
> the cable to outside monitor. 4. No chance you could interface with
> the built-in LCD screen.
>
>>If so, isn't there some unifying standard for digital signal
>>output (like, oh, DVI-D or DVI-I), so that I need not get, for example, a
>>card dedicated to and hardwired specifically for the Dell's various
>>screens?
>
> What you'd really need is a new notebook... <g> Say you are
> determined, and there is a notebook that has the video adapter you
> wish to use, and say the motherboard matches the one in your notebook,
> you might be able to do a complete MB swap. But, why bother, it would
> take more work and money than a new one.


That's all true for low-end laptops, but many high-end laptops, including
Dell, have user-changeable video cards.

Tom

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Thomas G. Marshall"
<tgm2tothe10thpower@replacetextwithnumber.hotmail.com> wrote in
news:BRMWe.116$265.42@trndny07:

> Having thunk about this for some time, I'm still confused. Do I have
> the ability to change the video card in my notebook, just like I can
> with the desktop?


As a general rule, No.

I once transplanted a video card from a broken IBM thinkpad 770Z to an
earlier 770(Non-Z) to get the extra VRAM that the Z's card used. In that
case, the video card was a daughterboard inside the laptop. And the
exception rather than the rule. The daughterboard was probably extremely
proprietary, I doubt I could have used it in anything other than a 770.


The video connectors DO appear to be the same across several differnet
brands I've had apart (Dell, IBM, HP, Toshiba), but I suspect this is
largely merely a coincidence of everyone buying the connectors from the
same source, I doubt the pinouts are the same.

With the exception of user-removable items like PCMCIA/Cardbus, SO-Dimm
memory, and mini-pci modems and wireless cards, there's almost ZERO
industry standardization in laptops.


- FM -

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 14:06:37 GMT, "Tom Scales" <tomtoo@softhome.net>
wrote:


>
>That's all true for low-end laptops, but many high-end laptops, including
>Dell, have user-changeable video cards.
>
>Tom

Thanks for the update, Tom. I don't have a Dell notebook (but do have
another brand...) and though it is a high-end one, it doesn't (AFAIK)
allow a video card swapout. It does have a mini-PCI slot however. <g>

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Fred Mau coughed up:
> "Thomas G. Marshall"
> <tgm2tothe10thpower@replacetextwithnumber.hotmail.com> wrote in
> news:BRMWe.116$265.42@trndny07:
>
>> Having thunk about this for some time, I'm still confused. Do I have
>> the ability to change the video card in my notebook, just like I can
>> with the desktop?
>
>
> As a general rule, No.
>
> I once transplanted a video card from a broken IBM thinkpad 770Z to an
> earlier 770(Non-Z) to get the extra VRAM that the Z's card used. In
> that case, the video card was a daughterboard inside the laptop. And
> the exception rather than the rule. The daughterboard was probably
> extremely proprietary, I doubt I could have used it in anything other
> than a 770.
>
>
> The video connectors DO appear to be the same across several differnet
> brands I've had apart (Dell, IBM, HP, Toshiba), but I suspect this is
> largely merely a coincidence of everyone buying the connectors from
> the same source, I doubt the pinouts are the same.
>
> With the exception of user-removable items like PCMCIA/Cardbus,
> SO-Dimm memory, and mini-pci modems and wireless cards, there's
> almost ZERO industry standardization in laptops.


Since it looks like laptops are replacing desktops more and more, I would
expect then that the small-house pc manufacterers would be having a harder
and harder time, since notebooks can only be fab'd by larger companies.

Unless, of course, there are some generic laptop chasis + screens + power
supplies, etc., on the horizon. That would allow someone to build their own
dream machine, much in the way they can do desktops now.




--
Doesn't /anyone/ know where I can find a credit card company that
emails me the minute something is charged to my account?

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"PeterD" <peter2@hipson.net> wrote in message
news:l3toi1dbbbd3io1jvetru01meh34skol9u@4ax.com...
> On Sat, 17 Sep 2005 14:06:37 GMT, "Tom Scales" <tomtoo@softhome.net>
> wrote:
>
>
>>
>>That's all true for low-end laptops, but many high-end laptops, including
>>Dell, have user-changeable video cards.
>>
>>Tom
>
> Thanks for the update, Tom. I don't have a Dell notebook (but do have
> another brand...) and though it is a high-end one, it doesn't (AFAIK)
> allow a video card swapout. It does have a mini-PCI slot however. <g>

Dell laptops can be quite nice in this regard! The video card is about the
only thing I haven't upgraded on my Inspiron 8200...the CPU is socketed and
I've changed it, it has a mini-PCI slot and I've added then upgraded WiFi
cards,
of course memory and hard drive, and am about to change out my CD-R/DVD
drive for a dual layer DVD burner. I like having a laptop where I am not
locked in.

George

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

"Thomas G. Marshall"
<tgm2tothe10thpower@replacetextwithnumber.hotmail.com> wrote:

>Doesn't /anyone/ know where I can find a credit card company that
>emails me the minute something is charged to my account?

You don't understand how credit card processing works, or how
antiquated their infrastructure is. "High-speed" modems to them mean
1200 baud, they still run nightly batch jobs to run the charges, and
they've got so much invested in The Way Things Are that change is
_very_ slow.

For instance, until recently, "online" transactions meant "Drop a file
into a directory, I'll notice it, read it, dial a 1200 baud modem into
a mainframe, get your results, and write a file into that same
directory."

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

<William P. N. Smith> wrote in message
news:aumqi198a0r87b2i5htj3473onhbnvse9b@4ax.com...
> "Thomas G. Marshall"
> <tgm2tothe10thpower@replacetextwithnumber.hotmail.com> wrote:
>
> >Doesn't /anyone/ know where I can find a credit card company that
> >emails me the minute something is charged to my account?
>
> You don't understand how credit card processing works, or how
> antiquated their infrastructure is. "High-speed" modems to them mean
> 1200 baud, they still run nightly batch jobs to run the charges, and
> they've got so much invested in The Way Things Are that change is
> _very_ slow.
>
> For instance, until recently, "online" transactions meant "Drop a file
> into a directory, I'll notice it, read it, dial a 1200 baud modem into
> a mainframe, get your results, and write a file into that same
> directory."

Part of this has to do with the actual signal processing. They prefer
it clean, simple, and uncompressed. The less that is done to the signal the
less chance there is for error and compromise. There is also the issue of a
world wide network with equipment from just about every generation from the
original keypad only (no swipe) terminals to wireless multipurpose readers.

Many use batch file processing to cut down on over head and to allow for
multiple transactions in a single session during a low volume time period
for both the processor and the CC clearing house. Usually the choice is a
matter of cost and bulk. Companies that provide services with scheduled
billings to CCs use batch billing at a lower cost to them from the CC
company. Cost that get passed down to the customer. All CC companies (and
they are really the guys doing all the debit cards as well) us a mixture of
billing systems, batch, transaction, etc.

Most banks and such actually have this done by third party companies.
Most simple act as a pass-through, however a few have been found to store
data (AKA the clearing house in AZ that recently got hacked for thousands of
VISA card customers info. Despite their contract with VISA the explicitly
prohibits it from retaining any customer data.)

Some companies do a per customer transaction billing and some do
batches. Additionally some do a check billing to verify the card is good
but then batch bill for the actual amount. Non-pin debit card transactions
are often done this way. Additionally some companies have their independent
franchises batch bill them and then the company batch bills the CC
companies. This can add two to three days to the actual transaction from
delivery of goods/services to actual billing of the customers CC account.
Though with some CC & debit cards there can appear a pending charge for the
actual amount. Not sure how that works though.

Fraud alerts may be a nuisance at times, but the alternative is worse.
Said fraud alert features also allow CC companies to make their much touted
no loss claims that if a customers care is lost/stolen and fraudulent
charges are made, the customer will not be held liable. The TV commercials
on identity theft are amusing, but each of them can be backed up by actual
fraud cases. It's always funny as long as it isn't happening to you.

Push may come one day, but there are still issues. Hardware, software
and transmission cost to name a few. Then there is the security issue for
the transmission and storage of any information pushed to a customer. With
the current state of hacking on most portable devices, not to mention the
potential for simple hardware theft, I personally would rather not have any
such information pushed to my cell/pda/blackberry/handheld. They can secure
it on their servers and I can wait to access it via a more secure means when
I get home.

I'm not paranoid.
Just an enlightened target.
KC

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

In article <aumqi198a0r87b2i5htj3473onhbnvse9b@4ax.com>, <Unknown>
says...
>
>You don't understand how credit card processing works, or how
>antiquated their infrastructure is. "High-speed" modems to them mean
>1200 baud, they still run nightly batch jobs to run the charges, and
>they've got so much invested in The Way Things Are that change is
>_very_ slow.


Wrong headed thinking. They are not dummies, and they use 1200 baud
modems because they are soooooo much faster for this use.

1200 baud negotiates a connection almost instantly, and very few bytes
of data are transferred so speed hardly matters. A 28.8K or 56K modem
takes vastly longer just to negotiate a connection. A 1200 baud modem
is in and out long before a faster modem can even connect, vastly faster
than 56K could ever be. Nice and simple, and very fast!

1200 baud modems are still used by small shops, but mostly the
transactions for new setups are done via internet links today.

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Kevin Childers coughed up:

....[rip]...

> Push may come one day, but there are still issues. Hardware,
> software and transmission cost to name a few. Then there is the
> security issue for the transmission and storage of any information
> pushed to a customer. With the current state of hacking on most
> portable devices, not to mention the potential for simple hardware
> theft, I personally would rather not have any such information pushed
> to my cell/pda/blackberry/handheld. They can secure it on their
> servers and I can wait to access it via a more secure means when I
> get home.

Thanks for all that information.

A question about pushed information security: What really need be pushed?
I'm not sure I would lose sleep over someone hacking, say, the email
database and gleening the:

vendor
amount
date

{shrug}. That's all that really need be pushed to me over email.
Furthermore, CC companies really *ought* to be killing themselves trying to
implement this: it would radically decrease the customer's detection time of
fraud, and hence the total theft. I suppose.


--
http://www.allexperts.com is a nifty way to get an answer to just about
/anything/.

Archived from groups: alt.sys.pc-clone.dell (More info?)

Wayne coughed up:
> In article <aumqi198a0r87b2i5htj3473onhbnvse9b@4ax.com>, <Unknown>
> says...
>>
>> You don't understand how credit card processing works, or how
>> antiquated their infrastructure is. "High-speed" modems to them mean
>> 1200 baud, they still run nightly batch jobs to run the charges, and
>> they've got so much invested in The Way Things Are that change is
>> _very_ slow.
>
>
> Wrong headed thinking. They are not dummies, and they use 1200 baud
> modems because they are soooooo much faster for this use.
>
> 1200 baud negotiates a connection almost instantly, and very few bytes
> of data are transferred so speed hardly matters. A 28.8K or 56K
> modem takes vastly longer just to negotiate a connection. A 1200
> baud modem is in and out long before a faster modem can even connect,
> vastly faster than 56K could ever be. Nice and simple, and very fast!

Makes sense. That V.90/92 "kerrrrrrrrsshhhhhh-kaBOING PONG PONG" business
seemed to take forever back when I had no choice but to use dialup. But
then, I'm the impatient sort...


>
> 1200 baud modems are still used by small shops, but mostly the
> transactions for new setups are done via internet links today.



--
With knowledge comes sorrow.