Old PC Build starting to fail need upgrade/new build advice

Hi everyone!
As the title explains I'm looking for some advice on the route I should go... upgrade or build new.

Approximate Purchase Date: by Black Friday unless deals are available now

Budget Range: Upgrade $500 After Rebates / After Shipping; New Build ~$2500 After rebates/shipping (includes monitor and OS)

System Usage from Most to Least Important: Gaming, surfing the internet, watching movies
Games vary: Skyrim, FO4, Batman games(Knight, etc.), Middle Earth: Shadows, Just Cause 3, Sniper Elite 3, Civ VI, Mad Max, Borderlands, XCom 2

Are you buying a monitor: Yes... Acer Predator Z35P, current monitor Asus VW246H is going to another PC with monitor that's failing


Parts to Upgrade:
Current rig build:
CPU: AMD Phenom II X3 740 Black Edition Heka Triple-Core 3.0 GHz Socket AM3 95W
CPU Cooler: Noctua NH-U9B SE2 92mm SSO CPU Cooler
Mobo: ASRock 870 EXTREME3 (SATA port and MEM channels maybe failing)
Mem: Corsair Vengeance 16 GB (4 x 4 GB) DDR3 1600 MHz
Storage: System OS (Win10): G.SKILL Phoenix Pro Series 2.5" 120GB
Data: 1 TB WD Blue SATA III 7200 RPM 64 MB (almost full!)
Data: Seagate 4TB Gaming SSHD
Vid Card: Sapphire 11244-01-20G Radeon NITRO R9 390 8GB
Case: currently in LIAN LI Black Aluminum PC-C33B but moving into a NZXT Phantom I got for free
PSupply: SeaSonic X Series X650 Gold or Seasonic SS-760XP2 (have boxes for both but don't remember which is where)

Do you need to buy OS: Yes if new build

Preferred Website(s) for Parts: PCpartpicker, Amazon, NewEgg

Location: USA

Parts Preferences: no preference

Overclocking: Yes / Maybe

SLI or Crossfire: No

Your Monitor Resolution: soon to be 21:9 or 3440x1440

Additional Comments: Would like to go to the AIO Corsair cooling solution (H100i V2) since new case will take it. Also would like to have some headroom with expected vid card upgrade down the line. Not stuck on AMD, and whatever gives me awesome performance in games will be a win for me.

And Most Importantly, Why Are You Upgrading: Current Mobo is starting to show it's age and I will get occasional out of Mem errors or 4TB drive will not show in OS. MEMtest doesn't find errors and multiple dimms still get errors. Losing 4TB is annoying and depends on the SATA slot whether it's found and if I get to play any games that given day or not. I would love to have the full 4TB of storage too!
Reply to kuguar_19
38 answers Last reply
More about build starting fail upgrade build advice
  1. Something like this and leaving you little more than $1000 for OS, Storage if needed, a case you like and a good 1440p monitor.
    https://pcpartpicker.com/list/LqrNM8

    Obviously you go a little cheaper on the GPU if you like.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  2. There's no really useful upgrade options for the current motherboard and a R9 390 is going to struggle on anything over 1440 rez so I'll suggest a full, new build is in order.

    Assuming the system will run happily off the 1Tb drive I'd seriously consider selling it as a going concern-Drop a cheap card like a GTX1050 in it then sell the R9 390 separately to take advantage of the currently inflated AMD prices on the used market.
    Reply to coozie7
  3. This would give you about $150 more for monitor and storage https://pcpartpicker.com/list/XWmwBP
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  4. Hows this grab you?

    PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

    CPU: AMD - Ryzen 7 1700 3.0GHz 8-Core Processor ($299.79 @ SuperBiiz)
    CPU Cooler: Corsair - H100i v2 70.7 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($109.99 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: ASRock - X370 GAMING X ATX AM4 Motherboard ($111.98 @ Newegg)
    Memory: G.Skill - Trident Z 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3000 Memory ($152.99 @ Newegg)
    Video Card: Zotac - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB AMP Edition Video Card ($739.99 @ Amazon)
    Power Supply: Rosewill - Capstone 550W 80+ Gold Certified Semi-Modular ATX Power Supply ($70.98 @ Newegg)
    Operating System: Microsoft - Windows 10 Home Full - USB 32/64-bit ($102.89 @ OutletPC)
    Monitor: Acer - XF270HU 27.0" 2560x1440 144Hz Monitor ($543.90 @ Amazon)
    Total: $2132.51
    Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
    Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-09-03 15:02 EDT-0400
    Reply to coozie7
  5. It's for a gaming rig, so i would suggest Intel Kaby Lake over Ryzen as it is faster in gaming. This is with everything except case and storage https://pcpartpicker.com/list/rdvX6X
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  6. ^ Not at resolutions over 1080, once over that Intel loses most, if not all of its advantage and if the OP goes for a 4K display the differences are virtually zero.

    I also notice you moved to a GTX1080, nothing wrong with that, it's a fine card at 1440 rez (we, mine is anyway ;) ), but if the OP wants to go 4K, I really think my Ryzen build with the GTX1080Ti would be the better option.

    Note to Kuguar_19: We've not included any extra storage and the monitor is (in my case) a bit of a placeholder, it's not really what you want although I've included it just because...Well... I actually have it.
    Reply to coozie7
  7. @Coozie and Kasper: Thanks for the quick replies!
    Ok, It looks like new build is on the menu, hope the wife won't look for a lawyer any time soon!

    So, I'm really stuck on Widescreen and the Acer Z35P is what I keep coming to... can't find a local store that has one near me, but the internet says it's great.
    I know I'm probably going to have to pony up for a high end vid (GTX1080 family) to push that monitor, but I don't know if 4K is an option/available in the widescreen format yet. As Coozie says I can sell the AMD vid card I have now.

    I know that I won't be selling my current PC due to the mobo issues, so it'll be a donation somewhere. I'll pull my current storage off it though I'd like to upgrade the SSD to M.2 with some more substantial space.
    Also either of the PSs I have are modular and will power what you've both listed for me so far.
    The Phantom case will fit everything you guys have listed.
    So it's just a matter of CPU, Mobo, Mem, and Vid I believe.
    I'm currently AMD but at the time it was due to price and availability. Now I guess it's changed a little to availability and then price. :)
    Also this is just preference but not a requirement... I like the Asus mobos as they seem to have the best feature set.
    Reply to kuguar_19
  8. If you can afford to wait a bit, I would wait a few months to see what Intel brings to the table with the new Coffee Lake. It might very well turn the table around again.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  9. Coffee Lake? So are you saying this as to get the current intel hardware cheaper or get the new to market stuff?
    I do have until Black Friday, but after that I'll just have to lump it until next summer with my current setup.
    Reply to kuguar_19
  10. To get the new stuff. It's not likely the current stuff will drop much in price. With the new Coffee Lake bringing more cores to the table and with a faster clock speed than Ryzen it is very possible Intel will turn out to have better performance. Yet i'm not sure when it comes to 4K as at that resolution your GPU is the bottleneck and not the CPU.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  11. That big Acer is REALLY going to want aGTX1080Ti, no matter which CPU/MB you opt for.

    Yep, AFAIK, you'll sell that R9 390 pretty quickly.

    See if the system runs properly off just the 1Tb HDD/SSD, just disconnect the big 4Tb drive and see what happens, if it's fine then the system is just playing around with the bigger drive and ripe for a quick E-bay sale (or donation) as it stands.

    Those fast M2 drives are getting a little more affordable, but be a little careful about which one you use: There are a significant number of SATA drives in M2 format, often at inflated prices, either stick with true 2.5" SATA drives or full on PCI-E 3.0x4 NVMe drives, the former are cheaper than M2 alternatives, the latter much faster (and more expensive).

    OK, so scratch the PSU from our lists.

    Your choices on the actual parts, like I said earlier, there's no real difference between a Ryzen and Intel CPU at 4K, and very little at 1440 rez but the final build suggestion is going to depend on your choice of display, for a 1440 (2K) build either a i7 7700 or R7 1700 will be good, as will a GTX 1080, move up to 4K and you'll really want to go for a GTX1080Ti to push all those pixels at a reasonable speed, regardless of CPU choice.
    Reply to coozie7
  12. Yeah, at 4K it is only a matter what you like most of Intel and AMD. At 1440p I would still choose Intel.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  13. @Kasper: Is there some info on the Coffee Lake stuff? I've missed it in my reading here and elsewhere.

    @Coozie: Care to share some more info on the M.2? All I see on here and elsewhere is that it's the format to beat for speed and performance, and I'd really like to know what would be a good OS/games (Steam) solution. I plan on moving the current SSD to another PC for OS.

    So am I correct to assume that the CPU is no longer the bottleneck for game performance anymore?
    Reply to kuguar_19
  14. @ Kasper Jorgensen: HA! HA!, And I'd go AMD!
    I'll agree to differ on this point because both have their pros and cons at that rez.
    Reply to coozie7
  15. The Coffee Lake would be 6core 12threads for I7 and with a faster clock speed than Ryzen and expected around same price as the 7700K, can only be a win.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  16. Ok, so would your suggested mobo work with Coffee, or would any other current (X299?) mobo work with it?

    I'm not partial to either though I do appreciate everyone has a bias towards certain brands.
    AMD has worked for me in the past as I tend to only upgrade/build after running mine longer than the technology can bear the games I try to play on it.
    I guess that is where I'm hung up on this build...
    Reply to kuguar_19
  17. @ Kasper Jorgensen: Maybe, we'll see. Don't forget pricing, not only of the CPU but motherboard, AMD already have 8C/16T parts available for the same (or less than) Intels i7 7700K/Z270 combination.


    @Kuguar_19: Some makers are selling SATA 6Gb/s drives in the M2 format, nothing wrong with that, they fit a fair number of systems, particularly laptops, but for maximum speed you'll want to look for those that specify: 'PCI-E 3.0x4' and 'NVMe'.
    Reply to coozie7
  18. @ Kugar_19; Coffee Lake won't work on any existing motherboards according to the latest info, you'll need to stump up for X3XX.
    Reply to coozie7
  19. #coozie7 yes but a lower clock speed, which is why the Intel is better for gaming and specially more cpu intensive games. Most games do not care much for more than 4 cores as of now, that might change in the not distant future though.
    I think we will never agree on this subject other than it would be wise to wait for coffee lake and see how that compares to Ryzen.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  20. Coffee lake will be good, no question.

    However, my ryzen 1600 does pretty well. I'm overclocked to 3.7ghz on the stock cooler. As far as everything, amd is promising to support socket am4 until 2020. If that is true, in a couple of years you should be able to drop a new cpu in. They are already talking about a release next year, and then a shrink to 7nm, and maybe zen 2 being released later in the year. The charts I saw were old though, so who knows the plan.
    Reply to ohiou_grad_2006
  21. Ok, well I've done a little bit of poking around and here are the builds I came up with.
    i7 Build... https://pcpartpicker.com/list/FtpX6X
    r7 Build... https://pcpartpicker.com/list/2JfqvV

    This is just based on the earlier recommendations and what I could find out as far as what's compatible based on the mobo QVL lists.
    I know there is some flexibility with that but I've not had good luck in deviating from whats recommended.
    I was surprised to see only ~$100 difference. Was expecting more savings with AMD, but my choices may have affected that somewhat.
    Both mobos could be considered enthusiast, but they offer the feature sets I'd want for each platform, so unless there is something else compelling I stay with them.
    Feel free to give me opinions...
    Reply to kuguar_19
  22. Both builds looking fine, not sure to that m.2 drive but if you seen test where it is doing good then I guess it is okay. Personally I would take the Intel build but in the end the choice is yours. Seeing you go 4K you probably won't see much if any difference. This may change in 2-3 years from now when GPU gets more powerful so 4K is no longer bottlenecked by GPU.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  23. Another way to save with AMD. Are you planning to run sli? If not, look at the b350 boards. They will still allow overclocking and should give you some of the features of the x370 boards at a little bit lower price.
    Reply to ohiou_grad_2006
  24. I did look at the B350 boards but none really had all the features I wanted on one mobo. Also that wouldn't really cause a significant drop between the two, unless I went with a real low end one.
    Reply to kuguar_19
  25. Ok things are getting a bit more advanced here. My main data drive (1TB) seems to have failed or at least can't be seen by Windows. Biggest problem is that I hadn't been able to back it up to the 4TB drive. Now I need to build a new PC and try to recover data off of the 1TB. I think I know how I will build but not sure about how to recover if the drive can't be seen/read.
    Reply to kuguar_19
  26. The i7 will do better than the R7 1700 in lightly threaded workloads-and this means many older games which won't run at 4K-if you do regularly use this type of software either for entertainment or for hobby purposes then I'd go for the i7.

    The R7 1700 excels in heavily threaded and multicore software, if you use this type of software regularly and only intend to play more modern, heavily threaded games it's the better choice.

    If you will have a mixed usage really only you can make the decision as to which CPU will fit your needs best, will you want to prioritise multithread/core performance ( R7 1700 ) or single/dual thread/core performance ( i7 7700K )? Your call.

    Both the SSDs you list are SATA type, not PCI-E NVMe, so you'll lose a fair bit of speed with them.

    I've cost saved with a 75Hz Freesync monitor here:

    PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

    CPU: Intel - Core i7-7700K 4.2GHz Quad-Core Processor ($322.88 @ OutletPC)
    CPU Cooler: Corsair - H100i v2 70.7 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($109.99 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: Asus - STRIX Z270-E GAMING ATX LGA1151 Motherboard ($187.33 @ OutletPC)
    Memory: G.Skill - Ripjaws V Series 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-3200 Memory ($175.99 @ Newegg)
    Storage: Samsung - 960 EVO 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($420.98 @ Newegg)
    Video Card: Asus - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB STRIX GAMING Video Card ($779.89 @ OutletPC)
    Monitor: Acer - XR342CK 34.0" 3440x1440 75Hz Monitor ($699.99 @ Amazon)
    Total: $2697.05
    Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
    Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-09-04 13:26 EDT-0400

    And the AMD build with then same changes:

    PCPartPicker part list / Price breakdown by merchant

    CPU: AMD - Ryzen 7 1700 3.0GHz 8-Core Processor ($299.79 @ SuperBiiz)
    CPU Cooler: Corsair - H100i v2 70.7 CFM Liquid CPU Cooler ($109.99 @ Amazon)
    Motherboard: ASRock - X370 KILLER SLI/ac ATX AM4 Motherboard ($133.98 @ Newegg)
    Memory: G.Skill - Flare X 16GB (2 x 8GB) DDR4-2400 Memory ($125.99 @ Newegg)
    Storage: Samsung - 960 EVO 1TB M.2-2280 Solid State Drive ($420.98 @ Newegg)
    Video Card: Zotac - GeForce GTX 1080 Ti 11GB AMP Extreme Video Card ($759.79 @ SuperBiiz)
    Monitor: Acer - XR342CK 34.0" 3440x1440 75Hz Monitor ($699.99 @ Amazon)
    Total: $2550.51
    Prices include shipping, taxes, and discounts when available
    Generated by PCPartPicker 2017-09-04 13:32 EDT-0400
    Reply to coozie7
  27. Here is link to the Ryzen 1700 review. Scroll down to games benchmark section and you will see in most of the modern games 7700K beats all the Ryzen CPU even they are heavily overclocked at 3.9GHz and the 7700K running at stock speed.
    Then think how it will look if the 7700K is overclocked to between 4,8 to 5GHz.
    So to say Intel is only faster in old games are simply a false statement.

    http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/amd-ryzen-7-1700-cpu-review,5009.html
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  28. @ Kuguar_19: Try the obvious first:
    Reseat the power and data leads and check the data leads aren't kinked or tightly bent, this is known to cause issues.
    Disconnect the 4Tb drive and try the 1Tb drive in another motherboard connector.

    If no joy, start another thread in the storage or Components Forums you'll tap into a more specialised knowledge base.

    @ Kaspar Jorgensen: Yes, the i7 does beat the R7 1700 at 1080 rez, I've said that all along, and if Kuguar_19 was playing at 1080 I'd have recommended a i7 build in a heartbeat, but he's not, he's playing at 4K rez where the two are virtually equal:
    https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/Ryzen_5_1600/12.html
    Reply to coozie7
  29. Coozie, thanks for the reply. I'll have to go back and look at those M.2 drives but the WD was listed on Asus's QVL for M.2 for that board and it was cheaper. :)

    Honestly, I haven't had many games now or in the past that really used all of AMD multi cores. Also I still play quite a few older titles which has me leaning towards Intel.

    Right now my most pressing issues are the data drive I need to recover and getting the parts I want at lower prices.
    Reply to kuguar_19
  30. Well, from your last post, Kuguar_19 it looks like you'll be better served with an Intel build, and the i7 7700K is a massively powerful CPU...Enjoy.

    Can't offer much more help with the HDDs...Sorry, not really my field.

    The big Predator in both your builds is a bit much for my Capricorn tightwad blood, it's a top flight part right enough but you may want to consider the Acre I linked in my last posted builds-either will knock your eyes out but the Acer will leave you a little money left over for the medical bills. ;)
    Reply to coozie7
  31. Thanks Coozie! I may heed your advice about the medical bills, but the wife knows me and my Sinatra "My way" streak. ;)
    Reply to kuguar_19
  32. coozie7 said:
    @ Kuguar_19: Try the obvious first:
    Reseat the power and data leads and check the data leads aren't kinked or tightly bent, this is known to cause issues.
    Disconnect the 4Tb drive and try the 1Tb drive in another motherboard connector.

    If no joy, start another thread in the storage or Components Forums you'll tap into a more specialised knowledge base.

    @ Kaspar Jorgensen: Yes, the i7 does beat the R7 1700 at 1080 rez, I've said that all along, and if Kuguar_19 was playing at 1080 I'd have recommended a i7 build in a heartbeat, but he's not, he's playing at 4K rez where the two are virtually equal:
    https://www.techpowerup.com/reviews/AMD/Ryzen_5_1600/12.html


    I know you said that, and i agree. But you also seems to forget his future upgrade path. Unless you go total overkill with a GTX 1080 TI for 1080p 60Hz gaming and buy a GPU that suits your needs in terms of resolution and settings at todays games, you most likely need a GPU upgrade in 3 years from now. In 3 years from now, and with the best GPU you can get at that time to replace the GTX 1080 TI, it's very likely that the GPU will no longer be a bottleneck at 4K or at least not as much as of today. And with 1440p there will be no GPU bottlenecks anymore. At the same time you will not have to upgrade your CPU. Past has shown us that CPU for gaming can last much longer, i mean people are still using a 2.gen Sandy Bridge I7 to play modern games without much trouble. I think it is safe to say that a high end CPU will last you at least 1 GPU swap and also possible 2.
    So in the end, in 3 years from now and with a GPU upgrade, you will again see a large performance gap between those 2 CPU.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  33. Also i just stumbled across this for the I7-8700K Coffee Lake. Looks like it will be eating AMD CPUs for breakfirst ;)
    http://wccftech.com/intel-core-i7-8700k-cpu-benchmarks-leak-faster-than-8-core-ryzen/
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  34. Interesting, we'll see what it does when the official reviews are in.
    As a side note, the article says the chip will be compatible with current motherboards, AFAIK Coffee Lake will only work with 3XX motherboards, again, I'll wait until official information is available before making further comments.
    In the meantime, it looks like Kuguar_19 has a solution: i7 7700K+Z270MB+GTX1080Ti on a 4K display.
    How I envy him.
    Reply to coozie7
  35. The article says that it has been RUMORED that mobo manufactures will make them work with older chipsets with a BIOS Update. Obviously this is only rumors so only time will tell. I can't wait to see official reviews of those CPUs. Anyway, as I already have I7-7700K i'm not in for an upgrade this time.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  36. In your benchmarks above, I love how they cherry pick the benchmark where the 8700k does better than Ryzen 7, but in the last multicore benchmark, they drop to the Ryzen 5 1600x and won't show the Ryzen 7 in the cpu z benchmark.

    Also, in the top benchmarks, notice that they set up their highest 8700k benchmark against the lowest Ryzen 7. They didn't bother to use the fastest Ryzen 7 1800x.

    On the wprime2 bench at the top, yes the 8700k wins (slide 1 at the top).

    Notice the cinebench bench (2nd slide), yes the Intel wins on single thread, but the slowest Ryzen 7 wins on multicore performance)

    Slide 3 Fritz chess Intel win, I'll admit that.

    Slide 4 older cinebench benchmark, Intel wins single thread. However, multithreaded, yes Intel wins, but on the other hand, they benchmarked against the slowest Ryzen 7, 1700, not the Ryzen 7 1800x.

    Keep in mind, the 1700 is stock at 3.0 GHz and only boost to 3.7ghz.

    The 1800x starts at 3.6ghz. It will boost to 4.0ghz.

    So I'm thinking the older version of cinebench would show the AMD with a multicore win had they tested fairly against the 1800x. Also in the cpu z benchmark at the bottom, had they included the 1800x, I think the multicore performance would have favored amd.

    Those benchmarks are interesting, but they look cherry picked to me. It seems like they tested against slower amd CPUs SSO they they could show wins on multicore performance, whereas if they had tested against the upper end CPUs, those numbers would have looked different.

    I'm not impressed.

    Also here's something else, doesn't sound like ryzen is a one off.

    https://www.google.com/amp/wccftech.com/amd-zen-2-zen-3-7nm-cpu-architecture-details/amp/

    So it looks like we can expect 2 or 3 more releases of ryzen variants at least, and they are claiming am4 will be supported until 2020. I read somewhere they are saying the next release will be 5-15% increase in ipc, which if they can pull off say 10%, and increase clock speeds, coffee lake does not look as good, especially with how those benchmarks look cherry picked already.

    Only an opinion:)
    Reply to ohiou_grad_2006
  37. Coffee Lake look as good as next gen Ryzen does, saying they will be 5-15% faster is no different than what Intel is saying before every new generation.
    Also keep in mind that the Ryzen 1800x are $80 more.
    But I must say that I'll be amazed if AMD is able to skip 10nm and make the jump to 7nm in 2018 already, that would be exciting.

    Again, no one knows until official benchmarks are done after they got released and basically those benchmarks means little to me as I care more to see some real world gaming benchmarks.
    Reply to Kasper Jorgensen
  38. Agreed. Competition is good for all of us. Other things I saw previously said to expect another Ryzen release on 14nm in early 2018, and then the jump to zen 2 by the end of next year. Those may have been older maps though.

    I'm just normal when they compared though, they compared against the 1700. If 1800x is more expensive, maybe vs the 3.4ghz 1700x would have been more fair. Just thought it was interesting hope they picked the lowest Ryzen 7 to go against the top next generation i7.
    Reply to ohiou_grad_2006
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